Very good points. Worthy of consideration!

My problem is not with Jeremiah Wright. Rev. Wright's pastoral message of "black is beautiful" helped a generation of black people to gain confidence in themselves. I like Rev. Wright and have no desire to condemn either him or his messages.

My problem is three-fold:

1) First, with the church's mission (unashamedly black) because it makes white people feel unwelcome and it is discriminatory,
2) Second, with Obama's choice of churches because Obama is a presidential candidate and he chose a racist church (there were many other non-racist churches for him to choose from, and most black churches DO NOT have racist or discriminatory messages in their church literature or mission statements), and,
3) Lastly with Obama's inability to see that what blacks and whites find offensive about the situation is that he (Obama) does not find fault with the "black only" idea of his church.

Will Americans elect a President that does not see anything wrong with a church that makes whites feel unwelcome?

If a white president had attended a white church that had a published mission statement (and plaque on the front of the church) that said, "Unashamedly White," - would blacks have wanted to elect that man? No. In fact that white church would be sued.

Janet, I like Obama. Until he addresses this issue in the right way, he's a cooked goose at the polls in November. By my bringing it up NOW, I'm hoping to spur his handlers into seeing that Obama has not yet adequately put this issue behind him - but he can - if he sees it for what it is - discrimination.

Believe me, the Republicans aren't stupid. If Obama doesn't explain his membership in a discriminatory church adequately, they will explain it for him.

I do like your post very very much. I saw the PBS program with Rev. Wright and I like Rev. Wright. The problem here is not Wright - it's Obama. He's got more he needs to say about discrimination. Why? Regardless of context, the man wants to be president. He needs to disavow any organization that discriminates or makes any race unwelcome.

I hope all ya'll will still love each other all during this election even though there may be disagreements.

Bottom line: I think you guys (Zola and Janet) are both fighting for the same ideals - social justice, racial reconciliation, economic fairness, equal opportunity and social responsibility. In fact, I know they both are. I think just about everybody at this site is.

You guys may disagree about Obama and his church - but, you agree on 99% of everything else. Don't ever forget that. We've got to stick together!

;-)

Nora T.

OMG - yes of course. I have enormous respect for Janet and I agree with everything she has said! On this post too! I probably shouldn't use her posts to vent my frustration about Obama not adequately addressing the issues that the Republicans will throw at him next summer and fall.

We know he will get the nomination. As such, we all want Obama to win!

Janet, I admire and respect you! You KNOW I do!

First, let me just confirm to any doubters...what I like most about Zola is that she and I have dialogued...here and off-line. That's what it's all about! One of the problem's in our society, I think, is that we don't agree and, thus, we don't dialogue. So thanks, Zola, for continuing the conversation. Vent all you want!...it allows me to do the same!...and I like being able to develop my thoughts (and arguments!). ;-)

Now...to speak to Zola's points...

The "unashamedly black" talk, I must admit, has been one of the things that make me uncomfortable. However, that's why I feel the need to listen. I have other friends (who aren't pastors) who say similar things. When I talk to them and explain my discomfort, I realize that it's not that they hate me, my skin color, or what "my people" have done to them, it's more about owning and celebrating who they are. Though I haven't listened to Rev. Wright's speech to the NAACP yet, I understand he addressed that (I think he did a little in church yesterday, but I'm beginning to get confused on which messages I've heard where! :) ). He talked about the fact that "different is not deficient." I completely agree and have written about that in a previous post (http://janetmorrison.blogspot.com/2008/03/unifying-faith.html)...that incited controversy as well.

Fact is, we have a hard time accepting what is different. It's been the history of our country. Why do we think that message is about us and about hate? Why can't we look at in terms of people who aren't ashamed that they attend a church where their services are different than mainstream, traditional white churches? Why can't we look at it as people who are going to celebrate who they are and be proud of their dance, their music, and a message that moves the church to action instead of just keeping it within four walls and the pages of a book?

I think of Barack the way I think of my friends...he lives in a world that is influenced by white culture. Maybe he wants to have a chance to also celebrate his black culture as well.

Of course, let me state the obvious here...Zola is black. She, just like Obama and Wright, have personal experiences that I don't and won't ever have. While I am looking at this from an outside perspective of what I've learned over the years, she is looking at it from a lifetime of experience. ...which also demonstrates that every single one of us are individuals and each of us have our own reasons for doing things...so we can't lump everyone of a particular ethnic group into the one and assume something about their thoughts, motives, and opinions.

I would weigh in on my feelings about the presidential race and the racism from whites that no one is talking about, but I will save that for another time. I was glad, though, that it was finally addressed a bit on Meet the Press this past Sunday.

Good post Janet, and it's nice to see a thoughful dialogue among people who disagree yet still respect each other. I looked up the website of Reverend Wright's old church and they have a lot of good ministries for their congregation. I voted for Hillary in the California primaries, but I respect Obama, and I think his speech a few weeks ago was very thoughtful and direct about issues of race.

Oh...and Nora...I just re-read my comment. It sounds kind of blunt about the "doubters," so just for clarification, that wasn't meant to be rude. My apologies if it might have come across like that!

Janet, you are softening my outlook. It's so funny cuz it's as if I'm advocating that blacks should be more inclusive with whites and you are advocating that whites be more accepting of black culture. The fact that we are even doing this is cool. Know what I mean? We're really looking out for each other and we are good examples I think of reconciliation in this way.

Rev. Wright's OK. I'm really on Obama's side all though it's not so obvious. I guess I worry that he's not crossing all his t's and dotting all his i's.

I'm proud of all of us. We're doin pretty good.

The more I listen to Rev. Wright, the more impressed I am. You are right, Zola, I am advocating that white people should be more accepting of black culture. And I, too, am afraid for Obama. But I don't think he should change his message. I think the fact that he may be a "cooked goose" in November (or sooner) says much more about us as a society than it does about Obama.

Did you see the end of Wright's NAACP speech (see it here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=enMBtAwy0Xg). He's brilliant!

I wish I could find an email I sent out to my fellow [all white] doc students while I was in grad school. I was irritated at the way they were talking about the grammar of the students in their classes, yet weren't analyzing their own "ain't's" and "ya'lls." My argument was based on this article in Teaching Tolerance magazine: http://www.tolerance.org/teach/magazine/features.jsp?p=0&is=17&ar=186&pa=4
Wright articulated this same point very clearly and eloquently. Now if we could get more than black people to listen to it, hear what he's saying (and get past the "fire-y" type vocalizing that we're not used to), and critically think about it without placing judgment on it... sigh...

Ha! Nice memory, Pam! I went to the district convention, but didn't get chosen to go to the state convention. I may still go just to observe. Other than that, no political moves for me. I think I'm more cut out for the grass roots organizing. Right now that's where I think I can be most effective. Thanks for asking.